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	<title>Comments on: Has Favre Ruined His Legacy?</title>
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	<link>http://www.ticketsolutions.com/blogs/intentional-foul/nfl/brett-favre-ruined-legacy/</link>
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	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 21 Aug 2011 19:04:25 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Phil McCraken</title>
		<link>http://www.ticketsolutions.com/blogs/intentional-foul/nfl/brett-favre-ruined-legacy/#comment-210501</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil McCraken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 20:20:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ticketsolutions.com/blogs/intentional-foul/?p=9503#comment-210501</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m a Packer fan so I can&#039;t say if his legacy is tarnished for the average fan or not. For my part, his legacy in Packerland is forever tarnished, and his acceptance back into the fold should not happen without a heartfelt apology. I don&#039;t want some stiff, teleprompter-esque apology (as if he would even do that) simply to sell more cook books and warehouses filled with Favre jerseys.

Favre played for a bitter rival for the express purpose of causing harm to my team. Forgive me if I don&#039;t think such deserves to be put up in the ring of honor for my team. It&#039;s hard to stomach someone putting forth so much energy to harm my team and simply come waltzing back like nothing ever happened. I realize players leave teams with some hard feelings all the time, as has happened in Packer lore as well. But some just keep away like Taylor.  And they didn&#039;t do nearly anything such as Favre did.

Favre had every right to continue playing if he wanted to. It&#039;s HOW he got into the position he did in the first place that continues the saga of how Favre ruined his legacy. Favre &quot;retired&quot; to punish the Packer organization for &quot;lying&quot; to him which really was Thompson not doing as Favre wished as far as keeping Sherman (who needed to go and has not been in a key role in the NFL since to prove the point), keeping certain linemen (one of whom played poorly was soon out of the league and the other played fairly well), and signing Randy Moss (a team cancer who whined his own way out of the best franchise going, and soon realized it and bad mouthed the team who gave him another chance). THIS is what Favre got his undies in bunch over. He was flat out wrong. Which makes his childish behavior that much more hard to take. Even IF he was more right than wrong in the situation, it doesn&#039;t wash that he publicly bad mouthed the team and played for a rival. It just kills his legacy to have been so wrong about his own abilities and so wrong about the abilities of others. 

Favre was given far too much of the credit for the Packer success since 1992. The Packer turnaround began back in 1989 with Bob Harlan. He made the team worthy of Wolf giving second consideration when he was offered the GM position a second time since 1987 when he turned it down. Enough changes in management structure and revenue streams had been made for Wolf to take the job, perhaps even done with his 1987 exit comments in mind. Wolf brought in Holmgren and Favre. We can debate who made who between the two, but Holmgren made another Super Bowl with another QB, a feat Favre has not accomplished with another coach.

And it&#039;s not as if Favre magically changed the moribund 1986 Packers into a team winning a string of Lombardis. The team in 1996 had FOUR players that were on the roster in 1991, much less the depressing teams of the mid-80&#039;s. It took FOUR years for Favre to get his act together and run the team with any degree of efficiency. He was nearly benched in 1994 for Mark Brunell who I have little doubt could have done something special with the 1995-1997 Packers himself. People have this ability to telescope the early 90&#039;s and hand Favre exclusive credit for &quot;turning around the Packers&quot;. It makes for a great way for the NFL to market itself and move jerseys, but the facts are facts. Favre was simply a component of the Packers&#039; turnaround and there was another QB on the roster nearly as capable as he was until he was traded away and Favre was installed permenantly without hot breath on his neck.

And he DID have great success during the mid-90&#039;s, personally AND as a team member. But from the time Holmgren moved on, and Favre could slip back into his old bad habits, particularly in pressure situations, all that was obtained was Favre accumulating  personal stats (which are impressive in volume and show his unparalleled durability and longevity which cannot be marginalized or taken away) but killing his team in top tier games. This cannot be disputed. Favre&#039;s QB rating in playoff &quot;terminating&quot; games (of course then setting aside the year that never terminated, &#039;96) is a robust 69.0, Joey Harrington type numbers.

Favre was not disciplined enough to make himself elite. He worked somewhat to keep himself in physical form, but he did not take the MENTAL repititions necessary to be an elite QB. Therefore when the pressure was on he did not have confidence in himself. He did not have confidence in himself and so resented any real comptetion on the depth chart behind him. He was insecure and many of his actions point to this. In fact I think his desire to punish the team (TT) for not doing as he wished was born from his insecurities. If he had simply put more energy into being the best QB for his team he could be, he would have had all the confidence necessary  to be a champion more than he was, instead of being carried along on the wave of the second best team the Packer franchise had seen (&#039;96) in their now 90 year history. When Favre could have made a difference and stood forth as that difference maker in elite level games, he didn&#039;t. This was because he was not elite. He was a very good QB for a long, long time.

Embarrassing exits from the playoffs for most of the early 2000&#039;s, coupled with his lack of elite level success, his incessant waffling, and his pill/beer addled early career did NOT allow him to be such an ass in 2008. So many continue to believe that the Packer turnaround was due to Favre and he kept the Packers elite. It was the rest of the team and management who had a huge hand in the turnaround, and with Brunell and Hasselbeck having been in the fold at one point or another, the Packers had options other than Favre along the way. Favre was not the be all, end all that so many use to excuse Favre for his actions in 2008-2010 as far as jerking the Packers around and then playing for a bitter rival. 

The only elite succes the Packers had with Favre occurred with an excellent team across the board. Otherwise, embarrassing exits from the playoffs, leaving only a season&#039;s worth statistics for Favre to add on to his totals. He was good enough to use the other talent (which in the early 2000&#039;s did not match 95-97, but was fine enough for its era) to use for his stat building, but he did not supply the time and effort to be elite and help his team get anywhere near to glory. The closest the Packers came was in the 2007 season in which one could tell Favre already was holding it against the team for not making the Packers into the equivalent of the 1986 Dolphins or 1983 Packers - dangerous on offense, useless on defense.

At the end of the day &#039;95-&#039;97 &lt; &#039;92-&#039;94 + &#039;00-&#039;04 + &#039;08-&#039;10 + waffling, especially considering the Packers had other QB talent that started in total about 18 years, played in several pro-bowls, made three conference championships, and went to one Super Bowl, and THEN on top of which they had Aaron Rodgers in the chute ready to go. Favre simply milked being to good to let go, but not good enough (or wanted to work hard enough) to be elite. 

How this impacts other fans around the NFL at large, I don&#039;t know. All they have is the massive overhyping by the NFL and it distributors, his waffling (some of which is an extension of the media industry but some IS validly there to criticize Favre with), and wang-gate. It takes a Packer fan to care enough to look into the background of the situation. To be fair, Thompson IS known as a cold fish. But that&#039;s harldy knew in the NFL or the world at large. Thompson did his job the way he saw fit, and had nothing to gain by persecuting Brett Favre as so many want to characterize it. He needs to WIN GAMES to keep his job. He has to stack up wins into CHAMPIONSHIPS to continue to keep it. He MUST have thought handling the Favre situation the way he did the most expedient way to do this. And it turns out he was right. Perhaps most non-Packer fans don&#039;t know this, but Thompson was on Wolf&#039;s staff from 1992-1999, receiving two promotions - so he was a part of assembling the mid-90&#039;s teams as far as scouting talent. He then went out to Seattle and Holmgren and helped assemble the team that went to the Super Bowl in 2005, even though he had returned to the Packers as GM by then. Within three years under Thompson the Packers went from the dreadful 4-14 season to the NFCCG, and with Rodgers a few years later, winning a Super Bowl. Meanwhile Favre was instrumental in getting two coaches fired and solidifying his legacy as a playoff loser in the 2009 NFCCG with a completely different, yet very capable, team. So perhaps Thompson knew something the rest of us didn&#039;t, even other NFL insiders such as the Jets and Vikings. 

Favre was a man-child. When people (such as Holmgren or Childress) could corral the child and foster the man, success was on hand. When the child was let loose, bad things happened. When Favre only had gold digging, attention hungry Deanna and Bus &quot;10% of Gross&quot; Cook to rely on, the child threw his tantrums, even spurred on to do so, and the results were not pretty. Now hopefully the whole clan can just recede into the mists of time.

But, again, Favre burned his own legacy, no one took it from him.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a Packer fan so I can&#8217;t say if his legacy is tarnished for the average fan or not. For my part, his legacy in Packerland is forever tarnished, and his acceptance back into the fold should not happen without a heartfelt apology. I don&#8217;t want some stiff, teleprompter-esque apology (as if he would even do that) simply to sell more cook books and warehouses filled with Favre jerseys.</p>
<p>Favre played for a bitter rival for the express purpose of causing harm to my team. Forgive me if I don&#8217;t think such deserves to be put up in the ring of honor for my team. It&#8217;s hard to stomach someone putting forth so much energy to harm my team and simply come waltzing back like nothing ever happened. I realize players leave teams with some hard feelings all the time, as has happened in Packer lore as well. But some just keep away like Taylor.  And they didn&#8217;t do nearly anything such as Favre did.</p>
<p>Favre had every right to continue playing if he wanted to. It&#8217;s HOW he got into the position he did in the first place that continues the saga of how Favre ruined his legacy. Favre &#8220;retired&#8221; to punish the Packer organization for &#8220;lying&#8221; to him which really was Thompson not doing as Favre wished as far as keeping Sherman (who needed to go and has not been in a key role in the NFL since to prove the point), keeping certain linemen (one of whom played poorly was soon out of the league and the other played fairly well), and signing Randy Moss (a team cancer who whined his own way out of the best franchise going, and soon realized it and bad mouthed the team who gave him another chance). THIS is what Favre got his undies in bunch over. He was flat out wrong. Which makes his childish behavior that much more hard to take. Even IF he was more right than wrong in the situation, it doesn&#8217;t wash that he publicly bad mouthed the team and played for a rival. It just kills his legacy to have been so wrong about his own abilities and so wrong about the abilities of others. </p>
<p>Favre was given far too much of the credit for the Packer success since 1992. The Packer turnaround began back in 1989 with Bob Harlan. He made the team worthy of Wolf giving second consideration when he was offered the GM position a second time since 1987 when he turned it down. Enough changes in management structure and revenue streams had been made for Wolf to take the job, perhaps even done with his 1987 exit comments in mind. Wolf brought in Holmgren and Favre. We can debate who made who between the two, but Holmgren made another Super Bowl with another QB, a feat Favre has not accomplished with another coach.</p>
<p>And it&#8217;s not as if Favre magically changed the moribund 1986 Packers into a team winning a string of Lombardis. The team in 1996 had FOUR players that were on the roster in 1991, much less the depressing teams of the mid-80&#8242;s. It took FOUR years for Favre to get his act together and run the team with any degree of efficiency. He was nearly benched in 1994 for Mark Brunell who I have little doubt could have done something special with the 1995-1997 Packers himself. People have this ability to telescope the early 90&#8242;s and hand Favre exclusive credit for &#8220;turning around the Packers&#8221;. It makes for a great way for the NFL to market itself and move jerseys, but the facts are facts. Favre was simply a component of the Packers&#8217; turnaround and there was another QB on the roster nearly as capable as he was until he was traded away and Favre was installed permenantly without hot breath on his neck.</p>
<p>And he DID have great success during the mid-90&#8242;s, personally AND as a team member. But from the time Holmgren moved on, and Favre could slip back into his old bad habits, particularly in pressure situations, all that was obtained was Favre accumulating  personal stats (which are impressive in volume and show his unparalleled durability and longevity which cannot be marginalized or taken away) but killing his team in top tier games. This cannot be disputed. Favre&#8217;s QB rating in playoff &#8220;terminating&#8221; games (of course then setting aside the year that never terminated, &#8217;96) is a robust 69.0, Joey Harrington type numbers.</p>
<p>Favre was not disciplined enough to make himself elite. He worked somewhat to keep himself in physical form, but he did not take the MENTAL repititions necessary to be an elite QB. Therefore when the pressure was on he did not have confidence in himself. He did not have confidence in himself and so resented any real comptetion on the depth chart behind him. He was insecure and many of his actions point to this. In fact I think his desire to punish the team (TT) for not doing as he wished was born from his insecurities. If he had simply put more energy into being the best QB for his team he could be, he would have had all the confidence necessary  to be a champion more than he was, instead of being carried along on the wave of the second best team the Packer franchise had seen (&#8217;96) in their now 90 year history. When Favre could have made a difference and stood forth as that difference maker in elite level games, he didn&#8217;t. This was because he was not elite. He was a very good QB for a long, long time.</p>
<p>Embarrassing exits from the playoffs for most of the early 2000&#8242;s, coupled with his lack of elite level success, his incessant waffling, and his pill/beer addled early career did NOT allow him to be such an ass in 2008. So many continue to believe that the Packer turnaround was due to Favre and he kept the Packers elite. It was the rest of the team and management who had a huge hand in the turnaround, and with Brunell and Hasselbeck having been in the fold at one point or another, the Packers had options other than Favre along the way. Favre was not the be all, end all that so many use to excuse Favre for his actions in 2008-2010 as far as jerking the Packers around and then playing for a bitter rival. </p>
<p>The only elite succes the Packers had with Favre occurred with an excellent team across the board. Otherwise, embarrassing exits from the playoffs, leaving only a season&#8217;s worth statistics for Favre to add on to his totals. He was good enough to use the other talent (which in the early 2000&#8242;s did not match 95-97, but was fine enough for its era) to use for his stat building, but he did not supply the time and effort to be elite and help his team get anywhere near to glory. The closest the Packers came was in the 2007 season in which one could tell Favre already was holding it against the team for not making the Packers into the equivalent of the 1986 Dolphins or 1983 Packers &#8211; dangerous on offense, useless on defense.</p>
<p>At the end of the day &#8217;95-&#8217;97 &lt; &#039;92-&#039;94 + &#039;00-&#039;04 + &#039;08-&#039;10 + waffling, especially considering the Packers had other QB talent that started in total about 18 years, played in several pro-bowls, made three conference championships, and went to one Super Bowl, and THEN on top of which they had Aaron Rodgers in the chute ready to go. Favre simply milked being to good to let go, but not good enough (or wanted to work hard enough) to be elite. </p>
<p>How this impacts other fans around the NFL at large, I don&#039;t know. All they have is the massive overhyping by the NFL and it distributors, his waffling (some of which is an extension of the media industry but some IS validly there to criticize Favre with), and wang-gate. It takes a Packer fan to care enough to look into the background of the situation. To be fair, Thompson IS known as a cold fish. But that&#039;s harldy knew in the NFL or the world at large. Thompson did his job the way he saw fit, and had nothing to gain by persecuting Brett Favre as so many want to characterize it. He needs to WIN GAMES to keep his job. He has to stack up wins into CHAMPIONSHIPS to continue to keep it. He MUST have thought handling the Favre situation the way he did the most expedient way to do this. And it turns out he was right. Perhaps most non-Packer fans don&#039;t know this, but Thompson was on Wolf&#039;s staff from 1992-1999, receiving two promotions &#8211; so he was a part of assembling the mid-90&#039;s teams as far as scouting talent. He then went out to Seattle and Holmgren and helped assemble the team that went to the Super Bowl in 2005, even though he had returned to the Packers as GM by then. Within three years under Thompson the Packers went from the dreadful 4-14 season to the NFCCG, and with Rodgers a few years later, winning a Super Bowl. Meanwhile Favre was instrumental in getting two coaches fired and solidifying his legacy as a playoff loser in the 2009 NFCCG with a completely different, yet very capable, team. So perhaps Thompson knew something the rest of us didn&#039;t, even other NFL insiders such as the Jets and Vikings. </p>
<p>Favre was a man-child. When people (such as Holmgren or Childress) could corral the child and foster the man, success was on hand. When the child was let loose, bad things happened. When Favre only had gold digging, attention hungry Deanna and Bus &quot;10% of Gross&quot; Cook to rely on, the child threw his tantrums, even spurred on to do so, and the results were not pretty. Now hopefully the whole clan can just recede into the mists of time.</p>
<p>But, again, Favre burned his own legacy, no one took it from him.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Jake</title>
		<link>http://www.ticketsolutions.com/blogs/intentional-foul/nfl/brett-favre-ruined-legacy/#comment-208308</link>
		<dc:creator>Jake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Jan 2011 18:57:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.ticketsolutions.com/blogs/intentional-foul/?p=9503#comment-208308</guid>
		<description>I think Favre will be best remembered for 3 things.  First, he was one heck of a player and never backed down from a challenge, even if it cost his team the game with an interception.  Second, he was Brett FAV-RA in &quot;Something about Mary&quot; when we all learned Brett&#039;s acting skills were pretty mechanical at best.  Third, he wears Wranglers all the time when he isn&#039;t in his football gear.  Heck, he might even wear them under the uniform.  That proves he is a tough guy and backs up his football rep.  Wranglers are for tough guys playing backyard football in the mud.  Ask Betty White and Abe Vigoda.  So in summary,   Brett Favre is a tough guy.  Just ask John Madden.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think Favre will be best remembered for 3 things.  First, he was one heck of a player and never backed down from a challenge, even if it cost his team the game with an interception.  Second, he was Brett FAV-RA in &#8220;Something about Mary&#8221; when we all learned Brett&#8217;s acting skills were pretty mechanical at best.  Third, he wears Wranglers all the time when he isn&#8217;t in his football gear.  Heck, he might even wear them under the uniform.  That proves he is a tough guy and backs up his football rep.  Wranglers are for tough guys playing backyard football in the mud.  Ask Betty White and Abe Vigoda.  So in summary,   Brett Favre is a tough guy.  Just ask John Madden.</p>
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